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2025, 07 Dekabr, bazar, Bakı vaxtı 09:14

Hearing: Azerbaijan’s Persecution of RFE/RL Reporter Khadija Ismayilova


Azerbaijan. Baku. Journalist Khadija Ismayilova
Azerbaijan. Baku. Journalist Khadija Ismayilova

December 16, the Commission on Security and Cooperation in Europe, also known as the Helsinki Commission, held a hearing "Azerbaijan's persecution of RFE/RL reporter Khadija Ismayilova".

The hearing examined the conduct of the trial against Khadija Ismayilova. And looked whether or not the U.S. Government done all it could to secure her release and to address the closing of the Baku bureau of RFE/RL in December 2014.

Presiding over the hearing, Representative Christopher Smith (R-NJ), Chairman of the Commission for Security and Cooperation in Europe raised a number of important questions with regard to Khadija Ismayilova's case.

We present you the full transcript from the hearing below:

SMITH:  (Sounds gavel.)  The Commission will come to order, and good afternoon  to everybody.  I want to thank you all for being here today to discuss the  terrible plight of political prisoners in Azerbaijan, and in particular the  imprisonment of journalist Khadija Ismayilova. 

Khadija has done some very hard-hitting investigative reports on corruption at  the highest levels in Azerbaijan.  Khadija’s reporting hit its mark, and the  security services in Azerbaijan tried to intimidate Khadija from future  reporting.  They tried to blackmail her with compromising information. They  threatened her with arrest.  And she was always under watch.  But Khadija stood  firm and stayed focused on her important work.  In December of 2014, however,  she was arrested, and is now paying the price for her exemplary journalism with  the loss of her freedom. 

The government convicted her on spurious charges of embezzlement, illegal  entrepreneurship, tax evasion, and abuse of power.  She is now serving a  seven-and-a-half-year sentence in a women’s prison in Baku. 

Much of Khadija’s reporting was done as a journalist for the U.S.-funded Radio  Free Europe/Radio Liberty.  This means that the U.S. government has a special  obligation to do everything it can to secure Khadija’s release.  That means our  government must take every opportunity, must leave no stone unturned, in the  effort to secure her release.  The State Department must make Khadija’s release  a true diplomatic priority, not a talking point on page two of issue briefers. 

One of the questions we will pursue today is whether or not, and to what extent  our witnesses believe our government is doing just that.  At this point, I  would say we did invite the State Department to present testimony today.   Unfortunately, the appropriate witnesses are on official travel this week, so  we will circle back and meet with them in the very near future. 

Human rights organizations have documented Azerbaijan’s crackdown on civil  society over the last three years.  Just yesterday the Committee to Protect  Journalists released its annual report, and in the report they find that  Azerbaijan now leads all of the countries in Eurasia in jailing journalists. 

In 2015, Azerbaijan jailed eight journalists.  Today we are focused on  Khadija’s case, but there are dozens of other political prisoners, including  journalists, sitting in a jail cell in Azerbaijan. 

Judicial processes against political prisoners are often farcical.  In  Khadija’s case, the prosecutors charged her initially with, quote, “incitement  to suicide.”  Their case completely collapsed when their witness retracted.   The prosecutor also charged that she had illegally signed service agreements  with Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty employees.  The prosecution never produced  any of the 11 agreements they said she had signed, and the four witnesses  called to testify for the government’s case denied that they had signed such  agreements with Khadija. 

Today is the one-year anniversary of Anar Mammadli’s sentencing.  Anar is the  courageous head of EMDS, the leading election monitoring organization in  Azerbaijan.  He spoke the truth about the fraudulent 2016 presidential election  and is still paying the price.  I met with Anar’s father, a very gentle man,  just a few months after Anar was arrested.  And so many in his family are truly  suffering from his incarceration. 

I’d like to mention just a few of the political prisoners – and unfortunately,  as I said, there are many. 

Ilgar Mammadov.  This opposition politician was severely beaten in jail on  October 16th.  Despite winning a European Court of Human Rights case that said  his prosecution was politically motivated, the government of Azerbaijan will  not set him free. 

Intigam Aliyev.  This leading human rights lawyer is now serving a  seven-and-a-half-year prison sentence for his work seeking justice for  political prisoners. 

Rasul Jafarov.  This human rights activist is serving six-and-a-half years  because the government would not register his NGO. 

There are many, many more, including those who have peacefully practiced their  religion.  In total, the Norwegian Helsinki Commission estimates that there are  80 political prisoners in Azerbaijan. 

Over the years, the human rights situation has seriously deteriorated in  Azerbaijan, causing damage to its relations with the United States and other  countries, and damaged its own society by imprisoning or exiling some of the  best and the bravest and the brightest of that country.  The time has come to  send a clear message. 

Today, the Council of Europe is sending the same message to Azerbaijan.  The  secretary-general announced that he is investigating the human rights situation  in Azerbaijan to determine whether or not Azerbaijan is meeting their Council  of Europe commitments.  This is a very rare step for the Council of Europe, and  it’s the first time that this secretary-general has launched this type of  inquiry. 

A few weeks ago, Azerbaijan gave medical parole to two of its most prominent  political prisoners, Leyla and Arif Yunus.  We should all welcome their  release, even though it’s just a first step.  They are still under house  arrest, and we have not seen such a step in other cases.  I urge all of us to  redouble our efforts to pass legislation, and I have introduced legislation  called the Azerbaijan Democracy Act, a human rights act. 

And with that, I would like to yield to my good friend and colleague, Ben  Cardin, the ranking member, and to thank him for coming over from the Senate  side. 

CARDIN: Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

First, I thank you for calling this hearing on Azerbaijan.  As you will recall,  we had our annual meeting of the Parliamentary Assembly there recently, and we  used that opportunity to raise these issues. 

The retrenchment in Azerbaijan is extremely concerning, and I thank you for  calling this hearing so we can focus on one individual primarily.  Because we  have found in the Helsinki Commission, when you put a face on the issue, we can  make progress.  We’ve done that when with Sergei Magnitsky’s tragic  circumstance, we caused the world to react to Russia’s human-rights violations. 

And I think the tragedy that is taking place today in Azerbaijan – and we can  mention so many of the individual cases.  You mentioned the Yunuses, which has  a connection to my state of Maryland.  I know some family is here.  That  circumstance was outrageous, just outrageous – continues to be outrageous.  So  we need to put a face on the issue. 

And clearly the persecution of Khadija is a clear example of the backtracking  of Azerbaijan and something that we cannot allow to continue, the closure of  Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty.  What is clearly happening is Azerbaijan is  trying to cut off information.  We know Khadija was a reporter, a journalist,  and trying to do her job to root out corruption. 

On November 19th of 2014, I chaired an Helsinki Commission hearing, and it was  focused on the role of journalism in combating corruption.  We invited Khadija  to join us.  The overall theme was corruption in the OSCE region.  We invited  her, expected her, that she would be able to testify.  Shortly thereafter, she  was denied the opportunity to leave Azerbaijan.  And then, a few weeks later,  she was jailed.  And we know the rest. 

So I’m going to ask consent that her testimony that was submitted at that  hearing be included in this hearing.  And I do that because I think it’s  relevant, very relevant to today’s hearing. 

I’m going to quote one paragraph from that letter:  “Azerbaijan is part of the  Extractive Industry Transparency Initiative since 2004.  As in many other  global initiative, the Azerbaijani government uses the membership as an  argument against criticisms of corruption.  The country is currently under  scrutiny by EITI, as one of the main parts of the Initiative’s civil society is  paralyzed and cannot serve as a watchdog.  In non-oil extractive industries,  government-linked monopolies have a huge stake.  In 2007, the government of  Azerbaijan signed a contract to develop six gold and copper mines with a  consortium that is co-owned by the president’s daughters.” 

Clearly, we miss having her reporting in Azerbaijan so that we could have more  transparency into what’s happening in the country and to fight corruption in  Azerbaijan. 

The situation for civil society in Azerbaijan has only deteriorated further  since her arrest.  Azerbaijan’s new regulations on NGO registration, and  specifically NGOs’ ability to receive funding from outside sources, are so  restricted that almost all of the independent NGOs that have been working in  Azerbaijan’s multilateral stakeholder group for EITI can no longer operate.  I  don’t see how Azerbaijan can maintain its status as a complaint country under  these circumstances, something that we should be pushing hard for.  We need to  see much greater space for independent NGOs and journalists to operate for the  EITI process to achieve its true value. 

Democratic societies function best when there is a high level of trust in each  other and the institutions that underpin democracies.  Corruption undermines  that trust, and thus undermines the very foundation of democracy.  Corruption  has corrosive and cumulative effects on society.  Whenever corruption rears its  head – and every country is vulnerable – we must use all of our tools to combat  that scourge.  A vibrant civil society and a free press is essential to that  effort. 

So, Mr. Chairman, combating corruption may be the most important task that we  face today.  Unfortunately, Azerbaijan has taken one of our great  anticorruption warriors off the field of battle.  We need to work to bring her  back. 

SMITH:  Thank you very much, Ranking Member Cardin. 

Randy Hultgren, Commissioner. 

HULTGREN:  I don’t have a statement at this time. 

SMITH:  OK, thank you. 

CARDIN:  Mr. Chairman, I’m going to apologize to our witnesses – the Senate  Foreign Relations Committee, where I’m ranking member, has a hearing scheduled  at 2:30 today that I must be at when it starts.  So I apologize for not being  able to stay for the witnesses.  My staff is here.  I look forward to your  testimony. 

SMITH:  Thank you, Ben.  And thank you for your very eloquent statement. 

I’d like to now introduce our witnesses.  And without objection, your full bios  will be made a part of the record. 

But very briefly, we’ll begin with Mr. Nenad Pejic, who is the vice president  and editor-in-chief of programming at RFE/RL.  Mr. Pejic was named vice  president and acting chief executive by the Board of Directors on August 31st,  2015, and became editor-of-chief of programming in December of 2013.  Mr. Pejic  joined RFE/RL in 1993, when he was named the first director of the Balkan  Service.  Prior to joining the radios, Mr. Pejic held various positions with  Sarajevo television, including head of the news department in Belgrade,  correspondent, and program director. 

We’ll then hear from Ms. Delphine Halgand, who is the U.S. director of  Reporters Without Borders, a position she has held since 2011.  She runs U.S.  activities for the organization and advocates for journalists, bloggers, and  media rights worldwide.  Acting as Reporters Without Borders spokesperson in  the United States, she regularly appears on American and foreign media, and  lectures at conferences in U.S. universities on press freedom violation issues. 

We’ll then hear from Mr. T. Kumar, who is the international advocacy director  at Amnesty International USA.  Mr. Kumar has served as a human rights monitor  around the world and was a director of several refugee camps and refugee ships.   He also served as a consultant to the Quaker United Nations Office and was a  professor in Washington College of Law.  He has monitored several elections  around the world, President Carter – with President Carter and the Organization  for Security and Cooperation in Europe.  He’s also served as a judge of  elections in Philadelphia.  And I would note he was also a political prisoner  for approximately five years in Sri Lanka.  And Amnesty advocated for him, and  now he is an advocate for others who are similarly situated. 

We’ll then hear from Ms. Shelly Han, who is policy advisor at the Helsinki  Commission, was there with Khadija in the actual courtroom during her sham  trial.  Shelly joined the Commission in 2006 as a policy adviser for economics,  environment, technology and trade.  She has also previously served as the  acting director – chief of staff, I should say, at Immigration and Customs  Enforcement, or ICE.  And before joining DHS, she was a senior international  policy adviser at the Department of Commerce, working on sanctions policies and  international security policy related to the export of sensitive goods and  technology. 

I’d like to now yield to Mr. Pejic. 

PEJIC:  Thank you, Chairman Smith. 

First of all, thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today.  And of  course, in the interest of time, I’ll highlight just a few points from my  written testimony, which you received yesterday. 

Khadija Ismayilova is an internationally recognized investigative journalist  and prominent contributor to Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty Azeri Service.   The government of Azerbaijan began harassing Khadija in 2012, when she started  publishing investigative reports that, among other things, documented extensive  real estate holdings in Dubai belonging to President Aliyev’s son, his  daughter’s control of major stakes in the country’s telecom and airline  industries, and the ruling family’s ownership of extensive national resources,  including gold mines.  We believe that it is her reporting, actually, on the  Aliyev family that brought her to arrest and the closure of our Baku Bureau. 

The charges against Khadija relate directly to the work of Radio Free Liberty  Baku Bureau, of course, during the period she was our Baku Bureau chief, and  they are all false.  RFE/RL submitted detailed refutation to the general  prosecutor of Azerbaijan on August 18, 2015.  We received no reply. 

Khadija’s trial was a sham.  The proceedings were not transparent.   Journalists, international observers, and members of her family were banned  from the courtroom.  No motions or letters supporting Khadija were accepted  into evidence during the trial, including our letter refuting the charges  against her which I mentioned above.  

During the trial, the prosecutor declared that testimony in her favor would  create bias, and would therefore not be introduced.  Not one witness testified  against Khadija, and yet she was convicted and now she sits in prison.   According to Khadija, when tax inspectors were questioned in court, they  admitted that not a single document they saw had her signature on it.  They  also said they saw only documents shown to them by the prosecution, meaning no  other documents – from us, for instance. 

On December 26th, 2014, RFE Baku Bureau was raided by the police and  investigators from the general prosecutor’s office.  Authorities seize our  property and still have not returned it.  RFE/RL’s bank accounts were frozen.   Our longtime lawyer was barred from the case.  Twenty-six members of our staff  were interrogated by the general prosecutor’s office over the next several  days.  Some of them were literally dragged from their houses during the night,  and most of them did not have legal representation.  In April, their bank  accounts were frozen. 

The details of the charges against us were vague.  The investigators have  missed deadline after deadline for submitting their findings.  Each time the  next deadline arrives, they apply for and are granted another extension.  The  reason is obvious:  they haven’t found evidence of any wrongdoing by Radio Free  Europe/Radio Liberty.  In fact, some of the investigators have privately  conceded to our lawyer that RFE/RL has not violated any laws, and that they are  just pursuing investigation because they have been ordered to.  The  investigation is just a pretense used to prevent RFE/RL from broadcasting.  If  charges are ever brought against Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty, we will  disprove them in the court.  The next deadline for the investigators to present  their findings is December 30th, 2015. 

After the raid on our Baku Bureau, several members of our staff fled Azerbaijan  and have applied for asylum abroad.  Many others have stopped reporting and  remain unemployed.  Our former bureau chief, Babek Bakirov, remains under a  travel ban and cannot leave the country. 

And yet, the bureau might be closed, but the journalists continue their work.   Thirty percent more people visited, for example, the Azerbaijani Service  website last month than in December 2014.  The last month, it was the last  month when the bureau operated in Azerbaijan.  Despite the efforts of the  government to deny our journalists the ability to report the news in and from  Azerbaijan, our freelancers continue to cover protests in Baku live for RFE/RL. 

Today’s hearing, I believe, is another evidence of the prominence of the Azeri  Service, the importance of the journalism, and public awareness that the  charges against Khadija are groundless.  I am honored to be editor-in-chief and  to be boss of this group of people.  And I am honored by the courage and  professionalism demonstrated by Azeri Service and its Baku Bureau. 

Of course, our bureau remains closed.  RFE/RL Azeri Service has continued to  work from our headquarters in Prague.  But Khadija is in prison, her crime  being nothing more than doing her job as a journalist. 

To ensure that her work continues, Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty has  partnered with Sarajevo-based Organized Crime and Corruption Reporting Project  to launch a fellowship in her name.  Our aim is to encourage more investigative  journalism and to ensure that intimidation doesn’t win. 

With this testimony, I am very proud and proudly join international appeal for  Khadija’s immediate release.  Thank you. 

SMITH:  Mr. Pejic, thank you very much for your very strong statement and  rebuttal, and pointing out that the charges are groundless. 

We will have to take a very short break– there are three votes on the floor of  the House.  We have a minute to go on the first one, so I will run out.  But  we’ll stand in recess for about 15 minutes.  Thank you.  (Sounds gavel.) 

(Recess.) 

SMITH:  The Commission will resume its sitting. 

First of all, let me just welcome Dr. Boozman, a member of the United States  Senate and commissioner.  Dr. Boozman, any comments at this point? 

BOOZMAN:  No, just we, as always, appreciate your leadership.  And I had the  opportunity to serve with Chairman Smith for many years in the House of  Representatives on Foreign Affairs and Veterans Affairs, and nobody works  harder, you know, in the effort to help those that need help.  So we just  appreciate your leadership very, very much. 

SMITH:  Thank you.  And thank you for all your humanitarian work over on the  Senate side.  It’s tremendous. 

I’d like to now invite Ms. Halgand to provide her testimony. 

HALGAND:  Representative Smith, members of the Commission, thank you for  convening this very timely and important hearing.  Thank you for inviting me to  testify today.  By your invitation, you honor the work Reporters Without  Borders, Reporters Sans Frontieres, has done since 1985 to defend journalists  and freedom of information all over the world. 

Azerbaijan is ranked 162nd out of 180 countries in the 2015 Reporters Without  Borders World Press Freedom Index.  It means that Azerbaijan is ranked lower  than Egypt or Pakistan. 

In my remarks this afternoon, I will focus on three aspects of Azerbaijan  crackdown on journalists and press freedom:  suppression of media pluralism,  imprisonment of critical journalists – like Khadija Ismayilova of course, and  the violence towards journalists. 

President Ilham Aliyev has suppressed all media pluralism in Azerbaijan.  He  has orchestrated an unprecedented crackdown on the remaining critics for the  past two years.  The media regulation authority and manipulation of the  advertising market have brought broadcast media under control.  Corruption,  blackmail and intimidation have systematically been used to chase journalists  away from independent reporting. 

I would like just to highlight a few example(s).  The Baku Bureau of Radio Free  Europe/Radio Liberty was forcibly closed down after the police raid last  December.  The independent newspaper Zerkalo was financially strangled and  closed down earlier this year.  The main opposition newspaper, Azadliq, is on  the verge of collapse due to astronomical fines. 

So after successfully suppressing media pluralism at home, the Azerbaijani  authorities have waged a war against foreign-based independent media created by  prominent Azerbaijani journalists now in exile.  The authority seems to be  stopping at nothing in their determination to persecute independent journalists. 

By example, Ganimat Zahid is the well-known editor of the opposition newspaper  Azadliq.  Ganimat fled to France in 2011 and has lived there ever since.   Instead of being satisfied with forcing Zahid to flee the country, actually the  authorities are now hunting members of his family who are still in Azerbaijan,  like his 87-years-old mother, but also his nephew, his cousin, and so on. 

Another worrying example of the Azerbaijan government harassment of independent  media in exile is Meydan TV, a Berlin-based online TV station and news website  run by Emin Milli, an Azerbaijan journalist now living in Germany.  So Milli  fled to Germany in 2012 after 18 months of arbitrary imprisonment, and recently  he has given an interview to the international media about the corruption  surrounding the Baku European Games, and actually the Azerbaijan authority  enraged by the failure of their European Games media plan to conceal their  massive human rights violation. 

In addition, I want to highlight that all media support and press freedom NGOs  were forcibly closed down in 2014.  Among them, the most prominent one, the  Institute for Reporters’ Freedom and Safety, IRFS, which was actually a  Reporters Without Borders local partner organization.  Just to make you  understand the violence of this attack, the chairman of this press freedom  organization had to hide almost one year in the Swiss embassy before an  agreement was made to let him leave the country, and he’s now living in exile  in Switzerland.  His name is Emin Huseynov. 

So independent journalists in Azerbaijan are left with the choice between  arrest, exile, or silence. 

Twelve journalists – 12 journalists and bloggers are currently detained in  connection with their work in Azerbaijan.  The most famous of them is Khadija  Ismayilova.  As Nenad explained it to us earlier, she is a leading  investigative reporter, and her arrest was a political case from the outset.   She’s in prison because of her journalistic work and her human rights activism. 

I would like to highlight another case, the case of Rauf Mirgadirov.  His trial  began behind closed door(s) on November 4th.  And actually, the prosecutor  requested today a seven-year jail sentence for high treason, and his next  hearing is scheduled for December 23rd.  He might end up in jail for seven  years as well. 

We cannot forget the other journalists:  Nijat Aliyev, imprisoned since May  2012; Hilal Mamedov, since June 2012; Araz Guliyev, since September 2012; Tofiq  Yaqublu, since February 2013; Shaig Agayev, since February 2013; Rashad  Ramazanov, since May 2013; Abdul Abilov, since November 2013; Parviz Hashimli,  since September 2013; Omar Mamedov, since January 2014; and Seymour Khazi,  since August 2014. 

Arrests most of the time take the form of a kidnapping by plainclothes officer.   Journalists are arrested under trumped charges such as drug trafficking,  hooliganism, and trials are held in camera.  The courtrooms is often filled  with paid state servants in order to not allow family members to attend.  We  bear witness to tragicomedies in Azerbaijan’s courts with scripts written long  ago by President Ilham Aliyev. 

I would like to finish by giving you a few examples of the violence and  physical violence targeting journalists in Azerbaijan. 

Journalists are regularly threatened and even violently attacked.  The  freelance journalist Rasim Aliyev died on August 9 of this year in a Baku  hospital from the injuries he received when he was lured into an ambush and  beaten.  Rasim Aliyev is the fourth journalist to be murdered in the past 10  years in Azerbaijan.  The investigation into the death of Elmar Huseynov and  Alim Kazimli in 2005, and Rafiq Tagi in 2011, have yet to yield any credible  results.  Impunity for violence against journalists is systematic in Azerbaijan. 

So Reporters Without Borders would urge the Commission, the Obama  administration, and members of Congress to raise the issue of restriction on  freedom of the press in meetings with senior Azerbaijani official, to demand  the immediate release of all Azerbaijani journalists, to put an end to these  trumped-up prosecution, to abandon the practice of collective punishment, and  to investigate the murders of journalists.  Azerbaijan independent media need  your support, and sanction and visa denials should be considered. 

And I’m glad to discover the Azerbaijan Democracy Act, and Reporters Without  Borders definitely supports this Act, and will help to make it a reality.  The  United States must make clear to President Aliyev that it follows carefully the  crimes committed against journalists, and that the United States won’t accept  such crimes. 

Thank you again for holding this hearing and for giving me the opportunity to  contribute on behalf of Reporters Without Borders.  Thank you. 

SMITH:  Thank you so very much for your testimony and your recommendations. 

I’d like to now yield the floor to Mr. Kumar. 

KUMAR:  Thank you very much, Chairman Smith and other members of Congress. 

Amnesty International is on one hand extremely pleased that you are organizing  this hearing, on the other hand extremely worried by the developments in  Azerbaijan.  Azerbaijan stands out in that part of the world as an example of  how to silence peaceful critics in a most effective and brutal manner. 

One example is the case that we are talking about, Khadija’s case.  We have  been following this case and other cases, and one thing came very clearly to  us:  that any opposition – very peaceful, well-meaning opposition – will never  be tolerated at any cost.  They use every tactic under the sun to silence these  people. 

Khadija’s case is a textbook example to how to silence a critic in a very  effective and very brutal manner.  In her case, she was targeted not only for  reporting and media work she was doing; she was also investigating the  president’s corruption.  His family was involved in alleged corruption.  So she  was investigating that.  So the government machinery, every level of government  machinery, started to move against her.  They harassed her.  They blocked her  from going overseas, a travel ban.  All this harassment was going on.  She  didn’t budge. 

Then – it could be intelligence officers; we don’t know who did it – she was  filmed in a very intimate manner in her own house, and that was used as  blackmail tactics to silence her.  She didn’t – she said I can’t – I will not  stop.  They threatened that they will make it public and she did not back off,  so they put it online to humiliate her.  Not only they humiliated her, they  tried to humiliate her family as well.  Even her own sister was called names.   So it’s an extended, collective punishment was there because of one individual  who was trying to raise issues in a very, you know, internationally accepted  norms of media freedom. 

They played race card.  They used that she has some connection – her relatives  or someone have some connection who is Armenian, so they play race card.  It  did not work. 

So blackmail using intimate pictures online did not work.  Using race card did  not work.  Then they switched to using law as a weapon to silence her.  First  they tried to charge her, saying that someone tried to commit suicide because  of her action.  It did not go anywhere.  Then they – suddenly they found that  there is another way:  let’s charge her the same charge that she is going after  the president, namely the fraud and corruption.  So they went after her.   Instead of, you know, she was going after the president, they went after her. 

So what says this?  It says that the government machinery in every level –  intelligence, military, police, judiciary, lawyers, everyone – is working in  tandem, working in one tune to silence critical voices – peaceful critical  voices in that country. 

Then they brought her to charge.  They extended the detention just to harass  her without giving any fair trial.  Even when the trial started, her first  charges failed, then they brought in the corruption charges.  Then they went  after the lawyers.  Her one lawyer was forced to resign and other harassment  was going on.  So she did not have effective legal representation to represent  her in the court. 

The other one is, during the trials, they specifically selected a very small  courtroom so that outsiders can’t be there to observe the trial.  Even though  it’s a show trial, they didn’t want anyone else.  So what happened was there  were only 20 people who can sit in that courtroom; they filled the courtroom  with plainclothes folks.  She was in a white, you know, glass cage sitting in  the middle, surrounded by all these plainclothes folks.  Even diplomats, others  could not able to get in.  There were – intimidation were waiting outside.  So  eventually she was convicted. 

But one thing that – you know, we follow – congressmen, you also know, you also  follow a lot of cases.  What amazes me in this case is her courage.  Believe  me, I was shocked by how strong she is, and she didn’t budge.  Even after  putting her personal pictures online, she said go to hell, I’ll do the work.   That’s what she stands out for. 

So now let’s see what the U.S. government can do.  We comment on your actions,  including the Act you are bringing in.  One thing I have to commend you,  Chairman, is before we ask, you act.  Usually, for – (laughs) – sometimes we  have to go and ask.  You are actually one step ahead of us. 

But other recommendations is that – one is for the Congress, which is this Act,  but also to the administration.  For the Congress, we would strongly urge when  members of Congress visit Azerbaijan, CODELs, they should insist that they  would like to visit her in prison.  It’s nothing unusual.  You know, in Vietnam  Father Ly members of Congress have met.  It’s the will of the members of  Congress that matters.  So if the members of Congress can stood firm and say,  here, 20 of us are coming, we want to see her in prison, that should be  attempted.  Let them say no.  They should – it should be attempted. 

For the trial, any political prisoner trial now – this case is over – it’s the  ambassador who should be there, not the political officer, because the  situation is so bad in Azerbaijan the level of scrutiny should be the highest.   So ambassador should take time and go and give – it’s a political message. 

Third, the ambassador should frequently meet with political prisoner families.   In this case, mother and sister are there.   

Then, when it comes to the administration.  You know every administration, no  matter which administration, they are – they are known for making statements  and not following through.  Oh, we are concerned.  It’s not going to go  anywhere with Azerbaijan.  The only way that can – they have to ratchet up a  little bit.  So we would urge President Obama to meet with the family members  of Khadija.  When her mother visits here or when her sister comes here,  President Obama should meet.  He has done it with other political prisoner.   Not consistently; with China he never wanted to meet, but there are other cases  he met.  We would strongly recommend that Khadija’s mother be – if a community  bring her or someone bring her, President Obama should meet her as a symbolic  gesture that U.S. government will not stay silent when you harass and abuse  your own citizens who are peacefully raising issues of concern. 

Thank you, Chairman, for inviting us. 

SMITH:  Mr. Kumar, thank you so very much for your defense and your  recommendations. 

I’d like to now yield to Ms. Han. 

HAN:  Thank you, Mr. Chairman, commissioners.  As a staff member of the U.S.  Helsinki Commission, I traveled to Azerbaijan in late October, and I met with  government officials as well as the few remaining activists who were willing to  meet with someone from the United States. 

The mood was subdued among the independent activists, as many of their  colleagues were in jail.  And they and often their family members were facing  harassment from the government and were also under threat of arrest. 

But I cannot say that they were defeated.  In fact, they were defiant in the  face of the crackdown.  And they’re determined to continue to fight for human  rights.  And it’s exactly the bravery and the incredible optimism that Khadija  brings to this group and that she has shown during her trial and imprisonment  that have played a big part in keeping the activists motivated.  And Kumar  mentioned that in his testimony. 

On the afternoon of October 29th, I attended one of Khadija’s appeal hearings  at a courtroom in Baku.  And as Kumar mentioned, the courtroom was packed.  It  was full of even more attendees, and they were searching – everybody was  searching for a seat in this small courtroom on the crowded benches. 

And as we were taking our seats, there was a moment of confusion, and we were  all told to move to a different courtroom.  There was a mad scramble as we  rushed into the new room, and you had to find a seat or else you had to leave,  because you were not allowed to stand and watch the trial.  Apparently this  room-swapping technique is something that the court officials use so that  nobody can have physical contact or have – be able to exchange words with  Khadija as she’s brought in to the prisoner glass cage. 

So I could feel the tension in the courtroom but also the resignation.  It was  as if we were at a theater and we all knew the grim ending of the play, but we  held out hope that audience participation might somehow change the outcome.   There was no doubt that Khadija would be found guilty.  And it was not because  of the preponderance of evidence against her, because in fact the evidence  didn’t support the charges at all.  But it was because the whole trial was  being held to fit the government’s desired conclusion, a guilty verdict.  And  the court was now merely the stage on which to act it out. 

In reality, Khadija had already started serving her sentence on the day of her  arrest.  The only thing she did not know was how much longer that she would be  in jail. 

Since the guilty verdict is assumed, the punishment starts before the trial  begins.  Essentially every single prisoner – political prisoner in Azerbaijan  has spent the entirety of their pretrial period in pretrial detention despite  the availability of a bail system.  Khadija spent exactly – almost exactly one  year in pretrial detention from her December 5th, 2014 arrest to her November  26th, 2015 – excuse me, November 25th final appeal. 

The conditions in pretrial detention are often harsher than in the regular  prison system.  Khadija was not given consistent or sufficient time with her  lawyers to prepare her case.  Her family was obliged to provide her with food,  clothing and other basic necessities.  Her family visits were restricted or  denied.  And communication with the outside was extremely limited.  And Khadija  was punished, often by being put in solitary confinement, for issuing  statements or continuing to write letters from jail.  One of her letters from  jail was published in the Washington Post back in February of this year, and  she was immediately punished for that. 

When we arrived in the second courtroom, Khadija was already in the  glass-enclosed witness cage, where she spends the entirety of the hearing  process.  She cannot speak unless the microphone in the glass cage has been  turned on.  And in other hearings over the last year, the judge would cut off  Khadija’s mic if Khadija started saying something that the court didn’t like. 

The court had another particularly cruel practice.  As we filed into the  courtroom, the tallest and most burly guards were standing shoulder to shoulder  in front of the glass cage so that Khadija was not able to see or even  wordlessly communicate with her elderly mother.  So they were basically  blocking her off from seeing her mother.  So her mother was anxiously peering  left and right around the guards, trying to catch a glimpse of her daughter;  trying to find out did she look sick, was she in good spirits. 

So we took our seats, and Khadija pressed a piece of paper to the glass with a  message to her mother, but the guards quickly told her to put it down. 

The judge filed in and read a short notice about the procedure of Khadija’s  appeal.  And Khadija had one more month to file a certain petition, so the  court would send her back to pretrial detention for that full month’s time.   The judge quickly turned and left. 

As we were hustled out of the courtroom, I too leaned around the guards,  searching to make eye contact with Khadija.  I saw her, and we exchanged a  quick wave, a big smile and the universal peace sign.  And with that, I was  pushed out the door, leaving Khadija behind. 

Thank you. 

SMITH:  Thank you very much for your testimony and your work on Khadija’s case. 

Vice president of the parliamentary assembly, Robert Aderholt, and also of  course a member of our commission.  I yield as much time as you may consume. 

ADERHOLT:  Oh, thank you.  Mr. Chairman, thank you for this hearing today.  And  let me just say, having had a chance to visit Azerbaijan on a couple of  different occasions, I’m familiar with the area, have got to know some of the  officials there.  And generally speaking, Azerbaijan has worked with the United  States in many ways, and there has been a working relationship between our two  countries.  But certainly it’s situations like this and, you know, hearing more  details about Khadija’s situation that – it’s very disconcerting.  And  certainly, you know, I think it’s important, Mr. Chairman, to have this hearing  to learn more about it because, like I said, there is a real desire, I think,  from the United States to be in friendship with Azerbaijan, and we want to work  with them. 

But I think one of the things that’s very difficult for most Americans is when  they hear situations like this.  It’s very alarming.  And I think that it’s  important that these things come to light and that we make sure there’re no  Khadijas out there that are being imprisoned. 

Let me just – and I have got to slip out to another meeting here in a few  minutes, so, Reporters Without Borders, let me ask you this question.  How many  journalists would you say are currently in prison in Azerbaijan? 

HALGAND:  There are at least – there are at least 12 journalist and blogger  currently in jail in Azerbaijan.  And what is important to highlight, that most  of them were imprisoned since 2012.  So there has been a really harsh crackdown  these last years. 

ADERHOLT:  And you know, there seems to be a lot of newspapers there.  Are  there any independent voices out there in the media? 

HALGAND:  So what I tried to highlight was the fact that really President  Aliyev has been quite successful to completely silence independent journalist  at home but also the media in exile like Meydan TV or others and – by going  after their family members who are still in Azerbaijan, by crushing the media  financially and so on. 

ADERHOLT:  Thank you.  Like I said, I apologize.  I’m going to have to leave  shortly.  But like I said, I think there’s a real desire for the United States  to have a good working relationship with Azerbaijan.  But you know, this is –  certainly anytime you hear reports about this, the American people are – I can  tell you from my constituency are – when they hear reports like this, it’s very  disconcerting. 

And so I think that’s why it’s important, we need to learn from this hearing.   And again, thank you, Mr. Chairman, for hosting this today.  And I yield back. 

SMITH:  Thank you, Mr. Aderholt. 

Dr. Boozman. 

BOOZMAN:  Let me just ask a couple questions in regard to the broadcasting.   Are you able to continue broadcasting now? 

PEJIC:  We had an FM license in Azerbaijan, but we of course lost it several  years ago.  But even though we lost the FM license long time ago, we are – we  were able to keep the bureau.  We are now able to broadcast only via shortwave  and through Internet. 

BOOZMAN:  OK.  So do you have any idea of the size –  

PEJIC:  We do have some cooperation – sorry – with Turksat  TV, trying to  address Azerbaijan content in cooperation with Turksat TV. 

BOOZMAN:  Do you have any idea of the size of your audience? 

PEJIC:  Yes, I do.  It depends what you want to compare it with.  I think you  were not here when I mentioned that today we have 30-percent larger audience on  the Web compared to the time when we had bureau in Baku in December 2014.  In  November 2014 we have 1,138,000 visits on the Web, plus YouTube, plus social  network, et cetera.  So this is increase compared to, let’s say, May for about  15 (percent), 30 percent. 

BOOZMAN:  So what can we do?  What can Congress, what can the State Department  – how can we support you? 

PEJIC:  I think my colleague laid out pretty good ideas of what should be done.   We – at some point with the support from the State Department went to Baku.   And our representatives and the representative from the Broadcasting Board of  Governors – we tried to find out kind of three issues there.  Number one, was  there any misreporting that was done about Khadija?  Because we have no idea  about any single fact that represented in a wrong way.  Nobody has ever said  anything like this. 

Point two, we wanted to find out, OK, what are the wrongdoings that RFE/RL  office was done?  And point three, of course, we wanted to try to solve the  problem.  We got no – negative answer on all these issues. 

BOOZMAN:  For the panel, I guess, you know, with the issues you brought up,  what has the United Nations done, the U.N.? 

Shelly. 

HALGAND:  What? I didn’t hear your question. 

BOOZMAN:  The United Nations, have they played a role? 

KUMAR:  They have.  U.N. Human Rights Council – there was a joint statement  issued about six months ago, and U.S. did not take the lead, but they were  party to that.  That issue is important, that U.S. can take a lead.  Now U.S.  is not a member, but still they can – they can play a role in passing a  resolution next time, because when bilateral initiatives are not working, it’s  always better to go to multilateral, not only U.N. but also OSCE.  You know,  the ambassador has been doing a good job.  But again, that should be – that  avenue should be explored. 

BOOZMAN:  So are they more responsive to our – the United States’ intervention  or more so to the United Nations? 

KUMAR:  U.S. – they will react, but U.S. is not intervening in a meaningful  manner.  Making statements – they know that everyone makes statements.  That’s  what I said.  They have to go one step further by – you know, CODELs visiting,  they should try to meet with Khadija.  And also, most importantly, President  Obama – I strongly feel a strong message should be given by meeting the family  members.  That will give the message that U.S. is serious about it. 

They think U.S. is not serious.  That’s what’s happening. 

BOOZMAN:  I see. 

KUMAR:  So the bilateral, but also at the same time multilateral, they should  start with.  BOOZMAN:  Very good. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

SMITH:  Thank you very much, Dr. Boozman. 

What is a typical day like for Khadija?  You mentioned that she’s been in  solitary confinement.  How is she faring?  Because obviously there’s a  corrosive effect.  Every day that goes by, you know, life in a political jail  becomes that much harder.  And you would know it personally, Mr. Kumar. 

KUMAR:  I will say they are trying to break her. 

SMITH:  Trying to break her. 

KUMAR:  But I do – I will admit I don’t know about her, but given her  background, especially when they threatened exposing her personal – when she  said she doesn’t care, I think she’s a very strong lady. 

So I don’t know, but you may be able to –  

HAN:  I don’t know if Mr. Pejic wants to chime in, but I think that Khadija –  the attitude that she’s taken toward serving time in prison is quite positive.   I mean, she’s decided that basically she’s going to bloom wherever she’s  planted.  She’s been planted in prison right now by the government of  Azerbaijan. 

And in one of the letters that she did write, she said that – she said:  Prison  is not the end of life.  I’m strong, and I see it as a possibility to learn the  system from the other side.  Communicating with alleged criminals, who do or  don’t accept their guilt, I am learning the wrongdoings of the penitentiary and  justice system. 

She said:  In fact it’s an unparalleled opportunity.  And she’s going to use  the time to translate and write books and to do what she can.  So she’s  actually, I think, taken a really quite positive attitude.  Obviously she  doesn’t want to be in prison, but she’s decided that she’s going to make the  best of it. 

PEJIC:  Something to add – she’s under strict rules.  She has been prevented to  write.  She has been prevented to talk with her mother without control.  But  the message we got, she used the time to educate other intimates – other  inmates there, you know, on their own cases.  She’s helping them. 

HALGAND:  I just would like to highlight again the really difficult condition  and detention in Azerbaijan and the difficult access to the lawyers, to the  family members and to health care system.  So definitely that’s a point that  you should highlight in your own meeting with official, the difficult condition  of the detention. 

SMITH:  Mr. Pejic, the Radio Free Europe / Radio Liberty family – are they  very, very concerned about this?  I mean, is there a sense inside the building,  so to speak, that, you know, one of our own has been unjustly accused and now  incarcerated?  And frankly – and you may not want to answer this, but maybe our  other – Mr. Kumar has certainly answered it when he said that there – where was  it – the U.S. has not intervened in a meaningful manner.  Well, that can  change, and we will appeal to the president again to try to get him to – and I  think your idea is an excellent one – to invite the family, to make it clear  that he’s in solidarity with the unjustly imprisoned woman and not with the  process that has exploited her. 

But is there a sense among the radio and TV family that this is just an outrage? 

PEJIC:  Of course.  Of course.  She’s one of us. 

SMITH:  Yes. 

PEJIC:  Even she was not legally employed by RFE/RL, she was one of our  contributor. 

SMITH:  Right. 

PEJIC:  What I’m personally a little bit concerned about, to see how other  colleagues in other bureaus will react, because, you know, we are all human  natures.  And we all need to think of our families, et cetera. 

To the question about the U.S. government, I – of course as a journalist I  would like to see more aggressive approach there.  On the other hand, I have –  as I just outlined a few minutes ago, we did get help, and we are going there,  from the U.S. ambassador from the State Department.  And thanks to them I  believe we did manage to meet pretty high officials in Baku. 

SMITH:  Has Secretary Kerry raised this issue personally with Aliyev or the  foreign minister, as far as we know?  Is that something we should ask him to  do?  I mean, really, when I held a hearing on – with Naghmeh Abedini on behalf  of Saeed Abedini – and Frank Wolf held the first; I held two – at the first  hearing, she said the State Department said, there was nothing we can do.  And  at least in response to the outrage on Capitol Hill that was bipartisan – of  course he’s being held in Iran – was at least we got some words out of the  secretary of state.  But Iran is certainly not seen as a friend and ally the  way Azerbaijan is. 

So, you know, it seems to me that leverage needs to be ticked up real quick on  her behalf and hopefully – you know, a rising tide raises all boats, to quote  John F. Kennedy – there would be an effort – a more robust effort to counter  all of these jailings of journalists, bloggers and other human rights  activists.  Again, the Norwegian group puts it at 80 people who are prisoners  of conscience.  That’s a huge number of people for a relatively modest-size  country. 

So it’s something I think we need to – and this commission – you know, we met –  and Robert will recall, we had a very robust exchange with Aliyev when we were  in Baku.  And we were there twice, back-to-back years.  One was when the  parliamentary assembly was there.  The other was when Senator Wicker led the  effort.  We went there from Istanbul and raised these – not this issue  obviously because it was not on the table then – and met with the families. 

So we need to do more ourselves, and we will.  That’s why we’re having – or  we’re chairing – putting on this hearing and why we’re introducing the  legislation, which I think will get their attention.  And we’re very serious  about getting it passed.  Doris, I know, was sitting there, and Doris will  remember with Belarus – with the Belarus Democracy Act, which had some similar  attributes to it on visa bans and the like and holding individuals to account.   That is law, and it has had an impact, has not had the – had the full impact we  had hoped, which is democracy.  But my hope is that we can push this very, very  aggressively. 

Let me just ask you with regards to the U.N. – was asked by Dr. Boozman, and I  think it was a good question – you have the periodic review comes up – 2017 is  the next one.  A statement is important.  Hopefully more statements will  follow.  And so if any of you want to comment on what other bodies ought to be  doing besides Congress and the president, that would be – that would be helpful. 

Yes, sir. 

PEJIC:  Just if I can say one sentence, and I would like to excused because –  

SMITH:  I know you have to go. 

PEJIC:   – I have a really important meeting I have to attend.  We are trying  to get – and to prepare ourselves for this U.N. session in ‘17.  And there is  attempts at – with us, I believe, with some other organizations to have this  case there present on the human rights committee too – if possible to come up  with a resolution or something like that.  It’s going to happen, of course, at  some point. 

Thank you, Chairman Smith. 

SMITH:  Thank you very much, Mr. Pejic. 

HALGAND:  I want to highlight the work that the German parliament has done,  especially around the European Games last June.  And so we’ve – the work of  Reporters Without Borders office in Berlin and many very active members of  parliament in Germany – I think there’s a very important effort on that side,  which is definitely very important.  And we can also highlight, of course, the  work of the Council of Europe, but much more is needed from the U.N. and from  the U.S. 

And I just want to highlight that because we know that President Aliyev cares  tremendously about his image and especially in the U.S.  So I really believe  sincerely that there’s been not enough pressure from the U.S. and that he would  care if the U.S. acts strongly on these issues. 

SMITH:  Thank you.  Does that also include the private sector?  I mean, who  does he listen to?  Do we know? 

HALGAND:  So I asked this question to my colleagues, and they say actually  because we didn’t have so much real pressure, it’s – in the past, it’s hard to  know for who he cares.  But I think the example of the release of Leyla Yunus  clearly shows that they care about the international pressure. 

So it should just encourage us to raise the tone a little bit, because pressure  works. 

HAN:  Yes, I think certainly today’s Council of Europe announcement about the  inquiry on human rights is really important and – because it now, in concert  with the Azerbaijan Democracy Act, is – I think it’s showing a united front,  because I think that Azerbaijan has gotten somewhat of a pass from some of the  European institutions from time to time.  But I think that it’s hard for not  only the public but also for these groups to ignore the consistent crackdown  that’s been happening. 

I also would like to mention that – and in terms of the U.N., just this month  there was a periodic review on Azerbaijan’s adherence to the Convention Against  Torture.  And the report found that despite hundreds of allegations of torture  within the security services, there wasn’t even one prosecution.  So they were  pretty severely criticized and asked to do better on that part.  So it’s  important to understand that from the U.N. side. 

SMITH:  Do we have a sense of what caused this most recent crackdown, which  began on or about 2012?  What was the proximate cause? 

HALGAND:  So one of the explanation we see is that actually with the Arab  Spring revolution, there’s been some demonstration at that time in Baku in very  small size, if I could say.  But it’s one interpretation that we can have, that  the regime got scared that this kind of civil movement could duplicate in  Azerbaijan.  And we saw that at that moment the crackdown really step a new  level. 

So that’s a potential explanation.  But don’t believe it was a paradise for a  journalist or a human rights defender earlier. 

SMITH:  Yeah. 

HALGAND:  But that could be an explanation, the fear of an Arab Spring in  Azerbaijan.  HAN:  Yeah, I think that’s correct and also the situation in Ukraine.  The  Maidan uprising and the upheaval that happened there, I think, was also  disconcerting.  And it happened right around the time of a presidential  election in 2013.  And I think that at first observers felt that the crackdown  that was happening prior to the 2013 presidential election was related to just  the election itself.  But then it continued on after that.  It never let up and  in fact got worse. 

So I think that it’s perhaps a decision by the government that they just can’t  tolerate the independent voices. 

SMITH:  For those who do human rights reporting on the ground in Azerbaijan –  and Mr. Kumar, you might want to especially speak to this – what are the risks  to those people to report, particularly if their identity is known? 

KUMAR:  They will be – first of all, we were kicked out of the country and  those other human rights organizations.  We were deported.  And OSCE, as you’re  aware, for the election’s time, they themselves withdrew.  Any local domestic  Azerbaijanis who are trying to help, either direct or indirectly, if they get  caught, they’ll be in very bad shape.  So be extremely careful in getting  information and vetting the information to pretty much protect their identity  and their protection. 

HALGAND:  Reporters Without Borders correspondent in Azerbaijan works  unofficially for us.  And we have an official local partner, as I said, the  Institute for Reporters’ Freedom and Safety.  And he’s German, as I say, had to  hide nearly one year in the Swiss embassy before being able to leave and to now  leaving in exile in Switzerland.  So that’s the life of the human rights  defender in Azerbaijan. 

SMITH:  Is there anything else any of you would like to add?  Because your  testimonies were outstanding.  I think Mr. Pejic, you know, did a wonderful job  in just showing on the record how these are bogus charges, these are false  charges, trumped-up.  And all of you have provided, I think, the commission  very, very important insights. 

And in Shelly’s case, she’s provided insights to – and has been doing it –  

HAN:  Color commentary –  

SMITH:   – color – for all of us.  And I deeply appreciate that. 

You know, it was Thomas Jefferson who said, were it left to me to decide  whether we had a government without newspapers or newspapers without a  government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.  None of us –  even this politician sometimes doesn’t like the press treatment that I get, and  all of us feel that way, but would defend to the death their ability to  publish, free speech, which is our constitutional right.  And you know, we need  to promote this.  It is a universally recognized human right. 

And I would just ask you – I would ask you one last question.  That would be,  our ambassador on the scene, our mission in Baku – how effective has our  ambassador been on raising these cases, particularly for Khadija? 

HAN:  I think it’s difficult to assess.  I think he’s in a very – Ambassador  Cekuta is in a very difficult position.  And I think that he also must follow  whatever the State Department line is.  And I think they’re being careful.  I  think they’re trying to be careful, they’re trying to thread the needle of  maintaining relationships with Azerbaijan that we’ve had in the past but they  are not quite sure how to react.  And I think that direction from Congress is  probably helpful to the State Department to change that. 

KUMAR:  He doesn’t have to wait for this – either way, don’t do it or do it,  from State.  He has a lot of authority, all the ambassadors.  For example, he  can visit family members of political prisoners.  He can invite them and human  rights –  

SMITH:  Does he? 

KUMAR:  I don’t know.  I’m just – I’m just saying in general. 

SMITH:  Sure. 

KUMAR:  If he didn’t do it, then he should explore doing those things and also  having functions.  Even in China they do that.  So he should – if he didn’t do  it, I didn’t follow his actions.  But there are a lot of things they can do,  which I don’t know whether he’s doing or not.  Thanks. 

And also, as I mentioned earlier, any trial political in nature of this level,  he should be there.  That’s a political message. 

SMITH:  Your point was very well taken on that. 

KUMAR:  Sure. 

SMITH:  And I take it he was not there.  OK. 

HAN:  As far as I know, the ambassador has not attended any of the hearings.   And if he has met with family members, I’m not aware of it, but they – again,  if they have, they may have kept it quiet as a strategy.  But perhaps the  strategy should be changed. 

SMITH:  You know, I would respectfully submit that as an ally increasingly  careens in the path of human rights abuse and cruelty, that relationship  becomes less valuable and less reliable.  And frankly, I would also submit that  friends don’t let friends commit human rights abuses.  If we are friends, we  should be speaking – we should be the first and the foremost in bringing this  to light, in trying to mitigate and end it. 

So, you know, when we had our conversations, when I did and my colleagues, with  Aliyev in Baku the second time, it was extended.  People were leaving and, you  know, we had to get back to the conference.  And I said, let’s press this  individual, this man.  He was very engaging, but you know, we need honesty and  truth and a record that is as impeccable as it could be. 

So your testimonies have been tremendous.  We thank you and look forward to  working with you going forward not just on Khadija’s case but the other cases  as well. 

The hearing is adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 3:43 p.m., the hearing ended.]

 
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